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Thread: Russian Lockdown - 2K response in first post

  1. #41
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    I am Russian resident, and and i pre-purchased Borderlands 2 prior 15 semptember 2012 on steam.

    I made pre-purchase because i was ensured that game was not region locked and was a clean ROW (international) version, there was no warning about any limitations, which means there was no limitations and i paid for unlimited proper full version of game.
    Game was listed in my steam as Borderlands 2 pre-purchase and everything was fine.

    But 15 semptember 2012, my pre-purchased Borderlands 2 ROW without any limitations was converted into limited and region locked Borderlands 2 RU, and only 15 semtember 2012 warnings about limitations appeared on steam. This warning also does not cover entire list of limitation, only warns about language of game, and tells nothing about separated MP region, incompatibility with DLC and other limitations.

    When i paid for game i was ensured by steam advertising that i paid for:
    1) International version of game which includes english language files, and rest of language files listed on steam store page
    2) International version of game which allows me to play online with any player from any part of world
    3) International version of game that would be regulary updated at same time at any part of world
    4) International version of game that is compatible with any separate DLC and DLC season pass
    5) International version of game that does not have any limitations

    15 semptember 2012, these warranties became violated and entire advertising became a real fraud, as now i have:
    1) Russian version of game which includes only poor-quality russian language files
    2) Russian version which allows me to play online only with another victims of this fraud - owners of same russian version, and this means i would not be able to play with people from rest of world
    3) Russian version with separate registry which means possible separate delayed updates, separate achievements and rest of things
    4) Russian version which is not even compatible with DLC Season pass, since it could be activated with ROW version only
    5) Screwed Russian version which have a lot of suddenly appered limitations, which i would never buy if only i would be warned about these limitations.

    Thats not a product i paid for, thats not an advertised product.
    Last edited by ArtySHOCK; 09-17-2012 at 07:05 AM.

  2. #42
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    Agree.
    canceling pre order as fast as I can
    Quote Originally Posted by ArtySHOCK View Post
    I am Russian resident, and and i pre-purchased Borderlands 2 prior 15 September 2012 on steam.

    I made pre-purchase because i was ensured that game was not region locked and was a clean ROW (international) version, there was no warning about any limitations, which means there was no limitations and i paid for unlimited proper full version of game.
    Game was listed in my steam as Borderlands 2 pre-purchase and everything was fine.
    .

  3. #43
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    I really liked Borderlands. First I played pirate version of game, completed it and ANYWAY I bought Game of the Year Edition because the game was great and I had great gaming experience playing with people from the whole world. Now 2K put region lock on Borderlands 2. For what? Fighting piracy? There is no game that can't be cracked. Also I (and many different gamers, I'm sure) don't want to have only Russian language available because 1C spoils games with their localisations. If 2K won't take down this lock, I'll cancel my pre-purchase.

  4. #44
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    Signed up on forum just for that post, here's my story guys... Did a preorder in steam and now I read all this, so if they will not repair that I swear that I'll not ever buy games from 2k, ☺☺☺☺ing swear by all I have in my life and my advice to you all, do the same, PIRACY THE WAY OUT! Developers tell that to us by doing all that... From Moscow sorry for English

    Oh and I did one more mistake, bought a first part of Borderlands, even when all my friends played that game from pirate copies

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nekrozerd View Post
    I really liked Borderlands. First I played pirate version of game, completed it and ANYWAY I bought Game of the Year Edition because the game was great and I had great gaming experience playing with people from the whole world. Now 2K put region lock on Borderlands 2. For what? Fighting piracy? There is no game that can't be cracked. Also I (and many different gamers, I'm sure) don't want to have only Russian language available because 1C spoils games with their localisations. If 2K won't take down this lock, I'll cancel my pre-purchase.

    It's not about piracy FFS, it's about cheaper copies of the game. Well ☺☺☺☺, as stated here http://cdr.thebronasium.com/sub/16143 retail has no regional restriction, that means i can still sell them to some of my western "friends" without any repercussions. Double fail all the way .

    EDIT: I'm JK.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi239 View Post
    It's not about piracy FFS, it's about cheaper copies of the game. Well ☺☺☺☺, as stated here http://cdr.thebronasium.com/sub/16143 retail has no regional restriction, that means i can still sell them to some of my western "friends" without any repercussions. Double fail all the way .

    EDIT: I'm JK.
    Anyways its about money and this is annoying why they dont care about gamers\users? WTF?

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaBeR View Post
    Anyways its about money and this is annoying why they dont care about gamers\users? WTF?
    There's a contradiction in this sentence. Money and Care about people.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi239 View Post
    There's a contradiction in this sentence. Money and Care about people.
    But that's not just people man we're paying them, then they should call us customers

    I'm ready to buy a game for American\European price wtf, just let me free to play all over the world am I inside of Iron Shield again?

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaBeR View Post
    But that's not just people man we're paying them, then they should call us customers

    I'm ready to buy a game for American\European price wtf, just let me free to play all over the world am I inside of Iron Shield again?
    It doesn't matter if we're customers or not. We already gave them money everything else is our problem, that's how EA/Activision work and apparently 2K is on the same bandwagon.

    And yeah didn't you know that we still live in the freaking soviet union? Iron curtain is always on. I suggest ICBM's comrade lol.

    BTW this thread need's more vodka, borsh, chernobyl, AK-47 and Kuzkina mat'!

  10. #50
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    I can understand (though not necessarily agree with) restrictions on the cut-price Russian purchases - but it shouldn't affect the EU Baltic states, and even people in Russia should have option to pay more to get real version.

    Still limited confidence in idea of purchasing from retailers outside affected area, from what I can make out - looks like it will work, but no absolute confirmation.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamBC View Post
    I can understand (though not necessarily agree with) restrictions on the cut-price Russian purchases - but it shouldn't affect the EU Baltic states, and even people in Russia should have option to pay more to get real version.
    I totally agree with you. At least they could set one price for everyone and not cut off some features...

  12. #52
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    Everyone stay calm! 2K's Director of Marketing has contacted guys over at Reddit some hours ago (when it was 7:50AM at their office) and told them they know about the panic and are immediately starting to think of a solution. Please stay calm and wait for a few more hours.

    Quote Originally Posted by SaBeR View Post
    PIRACY THE WAY OUT! Developers tell that to us by doing all that...
    My dearest friend, I suggest you learn the difference between developers and publishers.
    Developers are those guys who make the game, put their hearts into it and stuff. In our case, some Gearbox guys even did not know there IS a Russian localization. Also, developers are sometimes even fired when the game is done (Infinity Ward).
    Publisher, on the other hand, is the one who sells the game, and pays the developers while they work. As such, they often become too self-confident and tell developers what they should do - not our case, though, thankfully. It was 2K who licensed 1C to translate and distribute the game in Russia, and it was 2K who neglected to warn us of limitations (that were planned from the get-go, I am sure).
    Let them redeem their misdoings, let's see what they decide.
    Last edited by Orc JMR; 09-17-2012 at 05:03 PM. Reason: added URL

  13. #53
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    Yeah, at least in the U.S. that would be called a "bait-and-switch", and is an inexcusably unethical (and in most parts of the country, out-right illegal) business practise.

    I hope your consumer protection laws are up to the task of securing you guys the ... ROW = "Rest Of World? ... anyway, securing a ROW version for you to buy. SUPER-ESPECIALLY, anyone charged the full Eurodollar price!!

  14. #54
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    This is totally unfair! We bought our versions and now they change regions/lang/and etc.? This is not we paid for! If it was with this restrictions from begening NOONE would have bought it! Shame on you 2K! I really likeBorderlands games and now you do this?! Please, return our international versions!

  15. #55
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    Guys, I'm going to put this here and hope I only have to say it once:

    First, I don't work for 2k - just a fan volunteer. Please save your rage.

    Second, I get that you guys are mad. Region locking in this day and age of digital distribution makes absolutely no sense. I would love for a link to the reddit post, Orc JMR. I think everyone would love to be able to read it.

    Third: Promotion of piracy, for any reason, is against forum rules. DOn't do it.

    Fourthly, in relation to the above: simply going from "we're going to have a civil discussion about how much this sucks and try to get it changed" to "☺☺☺☺ this I'm going to pirate the game" doesn't make a difference. Sure, you as the consumer don't have to put in the effort, but it doesn't make the "system" change. In fact, it makes whomever made this argument that region locking was a good idea go "see? gamers are just impulsive and need to be region locked." Talk about it, argue it, but immediately threatening that you're going to pirate the game does not get the situation changed.

    I would think that stamping out region locks in their entirety should be the endgame of the gamers effected by this, not throwing in the towel and forcing publishers to do things like make region locks in the first place.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Pax_ View Post
    Yeah, at least in the U.S. that would be called a "bait-and-switch", and is an inexcusably unethical (and in most parts of the country, out-right illegal) business practise.

    I hope your consumer protection laws are up to the task of securing you guys the ... ROW = "Rest Of World? ... anyway, securing a ROW version for you to buy. SUPER-ESPECIALLY, anyone charged the full Eurodollar price!!
    Most consumer protection laws would be satisfied if you allow an unconditional refund for those who ordered before the announcement. So far, everyone requesting a refund on Steam has got it, AFAICT.

    However, if they didn't publicise it well enough, they may have to allow that refund even after the game unlocks, or face consumer protection complaints - especially in the three EU member states affected.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Codex View Post
    Third: Promotion of piracy, for any reason, is against forum rules. DOn't do it.
    It's also immoral, unethical, and just plain wrong.

    I would think that stamping out region locks in their entirety should be the endgame of the gamers effected by this, not throwing in the towel and forcing publishers to do things like make region locks in the first place.
    I agree.

    Figure out the price for a global-unlocked version. Charge that price, regardless of local prices. Then, perhaps, offer a more-restricted version in regions where the typical price of a game is significantly lower than the globally-unlocked price - not instead of the global version, but in addition to the global version. IOW, "The global price is X. If that's just too steep for you, we understand, and will sell you a version locked to your region and language, for only Y."

    Poof, middle ground compromise.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamBC View Post
    Most consumer protection laws would be satisfied if you allow an unconditional refund for those who ordered before the announcement. So far, everyone requesting a refund on Steam has got it, AFAICT.

    However, if they didn't publicise it well enough, they may have to allow that refund even after the game unlocks, or face consumer protection complaints - especially in the three EU member states affected.
    Yeah.

    Also, sure Steam is talking about the lock ... but does, say, Amazon.uk even know about it? Do their pre-order customers in those EU countries affected, have any clue beforehand that they're about to get screwed by a "stealth region-lock" ...?

    Probably not, in all cases. Which means, there is a huge cluster**** of a problem coming down the pike.

    I hope 2K's efforts to come up with a solution to the problem bear fruit - both for the players' sake, and for 2K's sake as well.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Pax_ View Post
    Yeah.

    Also, sure Steam is talking about the lock ... but does, say, Amazon.uk even know about it? Do their pre-order customers in those EU countries affected, have any clue beforehand that they're about to get screwed by a "stealth region-lock" ...?

    Probably not, in all cases. Which means, there is a huge cluster**** of a problem coming down the pike.

    I hope 2K's efforts to come up with a solution to the problem bear fruit - both for the players' sake, and for 2K's sake as well.
    We don't, as yet, know for sure whether people purchasing through retailers like Amazon are affected.

  20. #60
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    Upthread, I saw a mention of players on Russian IP#s being restricted to playing with other Russian-IP players.

  21. #61
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    I'm from Latvia, was about to buy it when I noticed the note on steam page, started looking around what's going on

    too bad, well thanks for making this decision so easy for me now

  22. #62
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    Why i must play on russian when i want choose. Where is my money for Season Pass? Why u punished Latvia, Litva and all contries without russian citizens. I shall go drink vodka and dance with balalaika and bear... and go use torrent for downlowd all games, because now i do not trust all publishers

    P.S. and thanks for RUSSIANOLIZATION for USSR contries

    VIVA GLORY RUSSIAN MOTHERLAND AND LANGUAGE
    Last edited by Talualki; 09-17-2012 at 03:13 PM.

  23. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Codex View Post
    I would love for a link to the reddit post, Orc JMR. I think everyone would love to be able to read it.
    Ohshi, I forgot to link it, I was totally going to.
    http://redd.it/zxbmd

  24. #64
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    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.

  25. #65
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    So that's it, I'm off to circumvent IP finters and stuffs to buy a ROW version.

    I really hope those people over at Lithuania/Estonia - who did not know of this whole hassle and will find out they were framed at launch - will be able to get some help AFTER the release.

    Because they did not just receive "incorrect information", they were given a locked version in whatever language for international price - an apology won't do.

  26. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    Now these are some good news. I actually can't believe it. Hope it will be fully resolved. But what about Season Pass pre-order? Did we also get our Season Passes changed to russian version? And the pre-load still doesn't work.

  27. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi239 View Post
    Now these are some good news.
    Lol how this can be good news ? It fully "resolved" : all will stay as it is now, so go and get yous refund.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian
    Ummm how this touches 1C ? Cos they just stated what they have nothing to do with Steam distribution.


    And last question XCom: Enemy Unknown have "correct pre-order information" ? Or it will be transformed to "Russian language only" at relase week too?

  28. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by beastsnark View Post
    Lol how this can be good news ? It fully "resolved" : all will stay as it is now, so go and get yous refund.
    The good news being "we respond and try to fix something instead of just take your money and ignore you like EA/Activision". And i said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi239 View Post
    Hope it will be fully resolved.

  29. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    May I humbly suggest that you should extend the Premier Club offer to anyone who, as of this moment, has or had a pre-ordered copy through Steam, in the form of a non-trade-able coupon sent to their Steam account?

    That way, those of your customers who switch tracks and get a retail / box copy (reputedly, those are not region-locked?), can still get the Premiere Club goodies they were expecting for days, weeks, or even months.




    Edit to add: I say the above as an American customer, purchasing a global/regionless copy via an American IP. My only interest in the matter is to see my fellow gamers treated as square as possible.

  30. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    May I inquire if same language choice and multiplayer region restrictions will be applied to another upcoming 2K release - X-COM? Steam page provides no clarity on that.
    And if you can't answer that, could you be so kind to direct me to forum/place/person that can?

  31. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.
    .
    That's hardly very clear. Can't you just give us straight answers to the two questions below:

    1) Will CIS/RU versions of the game be playable in languages other than Russian? Y/N
    2) Will players who have CIS/RU versions of the game be able to play co-op with players from other regions? Y/N

  32. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zevran View Post
    That's hardly very clear. Can't you just give us straight answers to the two questions below:

    1) Will CIS/RU versions of the game be playable in languages other than Russian? Y/N
    2) Will players who have CIS/RU versions of the game be able to play co-op with players from other regions? Y/N
    Throw in pre-order of Season Pass and pre-load of the game itself.

  33. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    As I understood information in preorder page was not right. Now information right. Nothing will change. Russian f***d (as always), others must learn russian.

  34. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    thats ok and all canceled steam pre-order anyway but still

    2k needs to realize the fact that Baltic states still payd euro price for language and region restriction with language they dont speak.
    even with this kind of mistake we should atleast get the version with same price as Russia , i still would not buy it but there might be small ammount of people who would (we still have some actual Russians living here as a minority)
    oh ea and looks like they actually separated Baltic and CIS so glad that someone finally realized we are not part of CIS

  35. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    2K Games and 1C are aware that digital distribution pages for the Russian, CIS and Baltic States versions of Borderlands 2 contained incorrect information regarding the language and cross territory compatibility support. We apologize that this information was incorrect during the pre-sale and pre-order period for these territories. We are working with our partners to update those pages, and offer any customers who pre-ordered or pre-purchased the game the opportunity to cancel their order and receive a refund.

    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    While it's good to have some sort of an answer, I can't believe my own eyes what he just said. Basically, 2K's representative is saying that:

    1. People in Baltic countries, where Russian is not widespread, let alone official, can suck it.
    2. People who paid 50 euro ($65) can suck it.
    3. People who live in the affected countries but don't speak Russian can suck it.
    4. People who live in Russia but simply want English version can suck it because 2K can't be bothered to offer them full version for US price, in spite of evidence that we'll pay (regional prices in roubles were introduced on Steam in Russia merely a year ago, before that people were happily paying in US$).
    5. Publisher can't be bothered to negotiate with Steam to make lower-price copies non-giftable (which is where the root of the problem stems from).

    It unbelievable. Language is essential to life, it's our breath of thought. Every time a company decides it knows better than its customers in which language to offer its products and introduces regional auto-detection and language locks (EA's Origin store being the most aggravating example) it's punishing and discriminatory beyond all sense, reason, respect for human choice, or even practical mindedness. What about people who live in a country which official language they don't know (people on a trip, stationed soldiers, etc). What about people who are willing to pay whatever it is you charge for the full product. And so on.

    Blizzard has solved this riddle years ago, by offering Russian-locked WoW subscription for lower price along with a EU-priced subscription that allows to play on European servers along with Russian ones. People pay for it (me being one of them), and everyone is happy.

  36. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    Im sorry, David, but i can't believe that this is true. You can just give your customers game with AppID that they paid for. This doesn't require any sort of development effort at all.

  37. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K David View Post
    Additionally, we are working with our product development teams to investigate potential support for additional languages and options for our customers in these territories. While this was and is not possible for launch, we will provide an update this week on our progress.
    right i forgot to write this before.
    it was possible to suddenly change everything to russian version unnanounced a week before releass, but you have to "look into it" when you have to change back?specially for Baltic states, what exactly is the problem here? besides the fact that we got screwed over and dont trust you anymore that is...
    we clearly stated that we want english version we cannot speak russian so we do not want that version.
    and it cannot even be because reselling cheaper versions to outside or anything because newsflash WE PAYD FULL MULTI LANGUAGE PRICE . and its still there you can only buy the same russian version nobody wants for the price of a version you are not willing to sell us

  38. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by werty15 View Post
    right i forgot to write this before.
    it was possible to suddenly change everything to russian version unnanounced a week before releass, but you have to "look into it" when you have to change back?specially for Baltic states, what exactly is the problem here? besides the fact that we got screwed over and dont trust you anymore that is...
    we clearly stated that we want english version we cannot speak russian so we do not want that version.
    and it cannot even be because reselling cheaper versions to outside or anything because newsflash WE PAYD FULL MULTI LANGUAGE PRICE . and its still there you can only buy the same russian version nobody wants for the price of a version you are not willing to sell us
    Don't think that's what he meant, it was the information on the page that was incorrect, so the additional languages etc wern't there in the first place.

    Seems very odd no English language version of the game would be offered as standard, not surprised a lot of people are ****** off.

  39. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fugue View Post
    Don't think that's what he meant, it was the information on the page that was incorrect, so the additional languages etc wern't there in the first place.

    Seems very odd no English language version of the game would be offered as standard, not surprised a lot of people are ****** off.
    well to me it seems like they want us to be stuck with the russian servers and russian version just trying to add language support
    but why?
    we already had the world wide version with no problems untill they suddenly changed it?
    we are not part of russia or related to CIS and we still have full price not cheap russian only price so... what is stoping them to just contact steam and ask if they can change atleast the non CIS effected by this to be changed into worldwide version. at this moment it would seem like it would also be a good option for steam aswell, seeing as steam pre-orders keep getting canceled and people pre-order elswhere.
    and when this part is done then they can work theyr translations and language options for non russian speaking CIS areas

  40. #80
    2K! Give us the RoW version of the game. It will be the best way out! Just block gifting for Russia and CIS.

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