In case anyone is wondering, the French are still horrible.
In case anyone is wondering, the French are still horrible.
yeah, they are awful, you expanded decently from a bad start (which kind of goes without saying with the french, but to not have 100 gold till 30 turns in the game is unlucky).
hopefully i'll run into you again, and maybe we can have some more evenly matched civs... so if u see me in the lobby, just don't pick random. though it is pretty awesome that you're rated over 2000 and you play mostly random... i respect that more than the china, zulu, american only top 10 players... and even more than what i do (mostly spain and indians with my main account, with some americans and rare china in there too, on my other account i use it just to test out new strats or play random...)
my cap and main prod cities had no ocean squares so good luck with the cruisers
I think I was 1-2 techs away from modern infantry at that point, so even the japanese knights won't do anything to me
I actually kind of like that this happens to me so freaking often that I'm fairly good at dealing with it. Hmm...maybe I should start playing Mongols all the time.
I think I still would've had an opportunity to win if there hadn't been a top player present. Not that I'm complaining, mind you. I'm not going to improve my game if I never play anyone good.
I had 3 whale total for my 7 cities.. not great. You didn't have 15 cities maybe 9, I took 4 leaving you with 5. You played Japan very very badly. You got most tech bonuses yet you didn't have cruiser fleet and knights until 1200ad.. Lol. I dislike Spanish for the extra rush cost, it was slowing my production of armies big time. When I worked gold ye began to catch in tech. Don't ignore Mongol lol
Nice long game with MadDjinn Germans, rawjos french and me japs and a chinese player who left his capital undefended. Germans didnt get 100 G and that was pretty much game over for this useless civ. Rawjos played well with french by rushing collosus very early with GB and kept up in tech race using great ppl. (i was expanding/building my gold city early on)
Raw pulled up a nice trick attacking my cities with 2 movement riflemen with samurai castle giving him same attack as knigts! So we fought in idustrial era and the french city with collusus kept on trading hands between chinese and japs. His capital was heavily defended with elite riflemenarmies with walls.
I was all set for a non dom economic victory (quiet a few cities and +10 gold bonus with my main city as gold city..but raw wanted to goto bed. So i got bomber wings with battlship support to take paris down.
Game froze for as ususal when Raws defences were wiped out. And then a nice message from him followed up telling me i am very bad palayer not to win dom earlier with japs! But hey Raw its only a game for fun ad i am not often a domination player so chill.
Last edited by bravo1717; 04-25-2009 at 06:53 AM.
The game dragged out until 1650 before it froze, an absolute joke. My God you couldn't kill a French player before 1500? WTF. You stole religion, university and flight from my cities, lol, Japan is a tech civ yet you were stealing tech from the French!
You had a second cap in the first 10 turns, I saw you got 4 caravans from barbs and who knows how much from other huts? I just reached 120 gold. Md never reached 100. If I was in your position and had a nice three city start in control of the bottom of the continent via chokepoints, the game would have been over by 1000ad at the very very latest. This is out of respect to fellow players. I don't drag out the misery. I told you it was 6am my time and I told you to hurry. Yet you obviously don't know how to use Japan aggressively.
I realise this game is all about luck, but the French would need all the luck in the world to beat a semi decent Japanese player. I won 4 battles against the odds you won 8, so no luck in that front either. Md got the Germans, he had no gold yet you didn't finish him off to well after the AD. He had 7 tech to our evenly matched 28 at 1000AD and he knew he was screwed from early on yet it took you that long to kill him.....
I just ask that in future you don't take all day to kill off players who are at a clear disadvantage.... It's disrespectful, I nearly always cut to the chase and go dom win.
yeah, I'm not so good with the germans...
rawjos plays the japanese a lot and is very ood with them. so when he sees someone else playing them and is ahead he cries.
I got 3 caravans and had to sell 1 as it was geting ambushed by MADJ so i got 130G in total from exploration and that also a few turns after you. Did get one caravan later from fre currency. Bit you got lucky beating me irrigation, navigation monarchy narowly, invention and steampower, and then city of atlantis using GP and collosus. So u were not as disadvantaged as u say u were. Again my main beaker city goes gold with free market and i had to build defences as MADJ was hovering around with galleys and ninja legions. And ofcourse the first major japanese crusade on french was unlucky when my knights 22.5 list to ur archers(12).
And for the long game, well ur cap had elite riflemen armies (great leader) and walls and as you know my vet bomber wing lost on its own. So i realy neede the full force by getting battleship fleets from other end where i had no cities!
PS u got those tecs that i stole from atlantis and oxford univerity and not from ur puny beaker production. Infact u didnt even have metallurgy for french!
Sorry for keeping u back but you always have the option to quit to put yourself out of misery which u eventually did freezing the game!
Sorry if i was bit sadistic!
As for french being second worst, there is mongols, russians and perhaps germans are below them
As japs being in top 5 rushing civs, i can think of atlast chinese, zulu, aztecs, arabs and americans before them. so you need to look at your ranking of civs again.
And for taking MadJ out why did u not do it earlier yourself with your 28 to his 7 techs?
And wy did u build riflemen armies and not ninja knight for a proper war if u wanted early domination?
You cant play all defensive urself and accuse other person of unnecessarily prolonging the game
Last edited by bravo1717; 04-25-2009 at 07:54 AM.
those 6 am games can be not so fun if they drag on i guess. overall the chat lobby is a smashing success. it might be fun to pair some of the better players with lesser ones (like me) and stick together for a while.
wow, what an awful decussion that has been spawned on this great thread
there's valid points to either side, but the tone sucks.
if someone doesn't want to finish off the game, that's their choice, and it's more oppritunity to come from behind. i don't know how that would be done in that case, but yeah...
the germans are waaay better than the french and are not a candidate for the worst civ in my book. but that's a different topic.
smack talking is cool with me in game or online, but i value the friendly tone of the boards, and i like the input that you guys add to other threads. it was one game, and though it's intresting to read about the specifics of matches between board members, it's really crappy to read other's petty hangups about a single match. there's always bad games, mistakes, things that annoy others,,, just beat the **** out of `em next game and talk smack on psn, which is always fun
Civ rankings are a matter of opinion but tbh I think you are wrong. French and Mongols compete for the title of worst civ, with Russia and Germans being ranked above them. Russia is somewhat adaptable with good defence and food. The Germans which I place above Russia can be effective if played right and you have Gold. Germany could have invaded with 8 to 10 elite knight armies at 300AD if it had a decent start and a good production city. Your defence was poor at 1350AD so at 300AD you would have been utterly destroyed if the German strat had been pulled off.
Also I realise you are a quitter, you posted that you quit vs some chinese player, but I have never quit a ranked game and even when I threaten to in unranked, I rarely do and other players usually get their act together and finish me off. I have no problem losing to good players. It is a matter of honour. If you quit when you're down you will never learn to improve your playing skill. Hence I continue to play on... for the sheer challenge of it. I knew I had that game lost at 600AD but I didn't quit like a little girl. I fought on, and actually discovered an decent strat for the french.
ok guys, enough :P
as Grayson pointed out this was a nice thread let's keep it that way.
i also want to apologize for my bush league move with the capital abandonment yesterday. a civ couldn't be in worse shape with no gold/production/cities but i shouldn't have messed up your game because of it. it won't happen again.
just took on a semi-decent chinese player today and won
I only say semi-decent bc he quit when he tried to retake a city I stole from him and failed. he used cats and archers vs. my archers. he used non-vet cats, so I had the advantage at 15-12. he took me down to 1 life and attacked with his non-vet archers 5-3 my advantage. he lost then quit.
he had even taken Thebes before I found it (it was 1/2 way between us). it had the Col. in it, which gave him a boost to tech.
sad too, bc it was becoming an interesting game for me to try a slightly different strat with the mongols. he had even taken out both my vet horse armies on hard luck chances (12-9 my odds. that sucks).
he was very good at building archers in all his cities to prevent easy walk in for me. he expanded well, and was well ahead in techs most of the game (at one point it was 9 techs for him and 3 for me).
but... I got a GB via normal culture and beat him to monarchy. I know he was doing ok tech wise bc I had gotten construction from him pretty early (there was lots of hills around).
but... once I flipped my cities to tech, I had ~32 beakers/turn, so I back filled 5 techs when I finished COL. it was still early in the game and there were 2 AIs off in the far side of the map to be had.
granted, I got 7 barb hut cities in the game as they were all near me/on the main continent between me and the french/american AIs (who apparently did nothing all game). I think only one of those barb huts had no food. I also got 7cities pretty early (rushed barracks and a few units as he started wandering in my area).
had I not wasted time and units trying to take Thebes really early, I could've grown all of those cities and got much higher tech out of the deal.
sometimes the map is nice to the mongols
map can play too big a part in this game. they really should offer a mode with equivilant starts for everybody. my last game last night was against a serious noob (he settled a ge and ga in his capital and got his 2nd city flipped by france. even without that the map gave him no chance. he was pinned on a peninsula by france and i had just a huge land mass before my nearest civ with a choke point sealing it all off. it couldn't have been a less equitable set up.
it was fun getting on ps3 tonight.
first game was teams with me and moog (don't know him, is he on the boards?) vs. madjinn and rawjos
i started with aztec out next to only two barb villages and 1 hut. got horsemen and took madjinn fast. my partner was china and started close to rawjos who was the egytians. he didn't have much room. that seemed like the worst map ever, not much gold, and not much room to expand...
raw took ai quick, so he was stablized against an early loss. my partner spammed a lot of warriors early and got 4 cities before really teching at all. but then stopped expanding. we weren't on the same page at all on teching, i got nothing in 1 turn that he had already reseached and hardly any techs were had by teching jointly, which really stunk... with mics this is a lot easier, and makes the game a lot easier to tech. but at the same time it's nice to have the mystery i guess....
so my partner was blocked in and i had no gold. so i had to hammer out settlers and get 100g the old fashioned way.... we eventually quit this game, it would've been a lot easier if he had just gone for knights, not switched to communism when he got the pyramid, not rushed monarchy with a great scientist when raw was already in monarchy and i had already researched it too (ugggh). still, i got to feudalism first and took the tech lead, but it was such a horrible game that me and raw decided to quit after my partner left.
the ffa game afterwards was short.
rawjos got some revenge for madjinn... i had 4 warriors in 5 turns, but started right next to rawjos, but met his two warriors by one a hill. the game lagged as i watched him form an army by moving 2 warriors to join the warrior already on the hill and then attack.... from the second the turn started i had my warrior army trying to attack one of his single warriors, but it wouldn't do it, he was able to preform 3 tasks before it would even let me do one that's retarded, but it doesnt really matter. it was just bad luck, i wasn't in a good spot since that hill connected me to the contenint to the north and there wasn't much to the south (that i could see). i hate games that have civs starting right next to each other. then it's just a random warrior battle that can go either way, but usually favors 1 one the players.. but i still lost, so props to rawjos.
i'll try to get on more often. it's nice to play ppl i actually know from the board, just wish ps3 was a little smoother.
yeah, BK owned raw and I after you left... spammed legions and horses then jumped into Fund.
it would have been easier to defend had I gotten a better area to start in. too many hills, not enough anything else.
I made it to Construction in time to get some prod going for the last few units.
got AW (Great Pyramid) and started with Col. + cultured a GS which I settled.
only having 1 forest stopped me from getting enough prod going to get the huts before everyone else and making enough units for defense.
Yes, Blitz got my two caps but 3 turns before he got the last cap, I flipped Kyoto back. I kept supplying it with forces from an island city which was beastly with double whale. I held my cap but had to rush great wall for reassurance. Blitz had 6 to 8 armies, 13.5 attack each, I had 2 pike armies 1 was vet, and 2 non vet archer armies. My catapult army died due to bad luck. So I think Great wall was the right decision as he would have worn through forces.
After repelling Blitz' massive attack, I teched to steam, rushed 2 cruisers, made fleet, I had 2 vet knight and 1 pike army ready and so I went cap hunting.... Blitz admitted defeat after I retook Madrid.... I only had 4 island cities but they were huge, 1 had free market, another had great prod with oak. I had 3rd knight army left in my big island incase of invasion.
If I hadn't killed Grayson and got nav, we all would have been toast. No doubt about it, I had two artists but couldn't flip cap until I had rushed temple and settled 1 in largest city. GG
I played a mess of games last night. All ranked FFA games with random civs unless otherwise noted.
First game, I get the Arabs starting on a small peninsula with the Aztecs right below me. There is one stupid hut on my peninsula and the Aztec guy is going for HBR. He'll have gold and I barely have any, so he'll get a horse army together way before me. I fortify a warrior at a checkpoint and put a warrior army on a hill right above it. If he doesn't rush me, I've wasted a lot of time and barely claimed any turf. My stupid peninsula has no trees on it other than the two by Tripoli! Why do I always get starting positions like this? If the Aztecs do rush me, I can kill their horse army and probably take their capitol if they don't have another 120 gold to raise another army. If they do, I'm dead. Can't hang around killing horses all day.
For some reason the Aztec player quits at this point. Maybe he couldn't find enough gold or something. I dunno. He definitely quit because he paused the game first. The Indians had captured the stupid Spanish settler early in the game, so he was my only remaining opponent. I knew the dumb AI would stop making horses and try to grow the capitol, so I sent my warrior army down to take the city, which they did no problem. On the way, I see Thebes with the Collosses. I set both my cities to produce horses (Montezuma taught me how to ride), so I can rush the Egyptians. If I take Thebes, it's unlikely the Indian player can keep up. Then the game freezes. Bah.
I message the Indian player and he suggests we have a rematch playing h2h unranked. Sure, why not? He takes the Indians again and I get the Spanish, a civ I'm a little more familiar with than the Arabs. I won't go into great detail, but he's a fast techer and I'm an expander, so he was way ahead of me in tech for a while. I started to falter a little having trouble producing enough gold. Maybe I expanded too quickly and rushed too many settlers. Then I found the Seven Cities. A short while later I got a Great Builder and the EITC and finished up some libraries, so I ended up being way ahead in tech and we called it. We tried a second game (my Zulu vs. his Chinese), but couldn't finish it. I had a bad start and he was ahead in tech again when we quit.
Back a bit later for more, I get the English. I've been getting them a lot lately and am becoming more comfortable with them. I make three warriors (because there are more than two directions to explore) and am doing a good job making gold. Hadn't found any dye yet. A hut gives me a spy. I move the spy a space and see an Egyptian warrior. I sell the spy and the game freezes. Argh. So weak. It was so early, I can't even claim that I was totally going to win that game (just like every other game that's ever frozen).
Ever the glutton for punishment, I restart my system and try another. I get the Romans playing against two Spanish and a Chinese (gamertag sidmeiers - hmmm, probably not that Sid Meier). The Chinese are very close. I only get one hut again and for some reason the river on my turf doesn't want to be named. Oh yeah, and no trees around me except the two for my cap. What is with this? Angor Wat is two spaces from my capitol. The spanish are picking up artifacts at a decent clip. I decide it's too important to deny them another one and build/rush a galley going even lower on gold. I get up to three small cities (two on fish) and you guessed it, a freeze!
Last one. I get the French (my least favorite) against Germans, Egyptians (Oracle) and Spanish. The AI is English. It turns out to be a great game for me. I get Angor Wat and Confucious fast. The Germans get the Ark. With English in the game, I have the Great Wall, which turns out well for me because I can steal settlers from the English, then force peace. I also take their Great Leader. Anyway, I get way ahead in tech by out-expanding everyone and grow Paris a lot so nobody could have units anywhere near me (Cathedral + Great Wall). Maybe I'm starting to figure out this civ? Probably it's just luck. Anyway, after I build the EITC with a Great Builder, the German player quits and we get that error where the turn won't end. I try diplomacy with the German AI several times, but the turn won't end. After a few minutes, I get the no longer connected to xbl message and the game counts as a loss.
Man, that sucks and I'm totally feeling for you. I know that; I got 8 out of 12 games frozen a few days ago. It seems like there are days where all games work blamelessly and other where everything is fcked up. It's incredible that me, you, and other keep playing it but it's so addictive and just fun - if it works - that you can't really stop.Originally Posted by elthrasher
I finally beat rawjos and LUFC_BIGAL with my mongols
raw was his usual japanese and LUFC was his usual English.
I ended up with 4 barb cities, all good. lots of food and tech. only one turned into a semi-prod city. my cap was my major prod city. (had rivers lots of food in it).
only way I got that though was to move my cap. I also pounded out the warriors and killed both raw's and lufc's warriors that were close to a barb hut I wanted.
with a good base, I went a teching. started with 17 beakers/turn and beelined to Literacy. (brought me to 22). I tech'd HBR then, and back filled BW and Pottery. beelined to irrigation getting the wall and the +1 pop bonus.
teched COL (got trading post) then used a GS on Democracy bc LUFC GB'd the Samurai Castle. I needed pikes at that point.
back filled more after democracy and went for Math/Nav. then Construction/Engineering/Invention. got them all first. GS at Invention I used for Steam Power. took the Aztec cap and used spies to pull a GA and GS out of there first.
worked on some lower techs as I had found Atlantis, then got University, Gunpowder and something else. I tech'd Metallurgy then GS'd Combustion.
finished the Hanging Gardens in my cap at the same time. tech'd railroads then started on Industrialization when we decided I had won.
(30 techs for me, 22 for LUFC at the end).
funniest part was that I didn't build a sigle horse or Knight all game.
Last edited by MadDjinn; 04-26-2009 at 03:25 PM.
I got far ahead in tech by the time the Germans took out the Russians with knights. Then the Germans attacked me and I responded with tanks. He forced peace, which was fine, because I was a turn away from Communism and hadn't built many temples anyway. I switched to Communism and blew up all the German archers. He quit. Then I felt like ending the game so I sailed down to Thebes with a battleship fleet and two elite tank armies. The Egyptian player quit.
There's really nothing like a good game with India. Putting cities on all the awesome resources is just great. You almost never get to take advantage of rubber or aluminum with other civs.
I don't quite get why the Indian civ is an average one. The resources don't give you the full bonus until you researched it, right? Is this still that big of an advantage? I'm still pretty new to the game so I played with a few civs only.Originally Posted by elthrasher
Yeah, I just take the freezes. The matches that work make playing a bugged out game worth it.
you will get the full resources prior to researching them if you have advanced enough. each age you add 1 to the resource until it reaches its full potential.
Likewise, having those dye tiles in my early cities gave me almost as much of a bonus as the English would have. I was getting 3 beakers in ancient, then 4 in medieval. If I'd gotten to industrial without bothering to research monarchy (I did research it for the GP, but wouldn't have bothered if someone had beaten me to it), I'd be getting the full 5 beakers for my dye squares without having to research monarchy.
Uhm, that still doesn't sound like a very good bonus to me but thanks for the information. The bonus seems kind of conflicting with the fact that you still must research technologies even though you can use the resources which are bonded to these. Guess, I'll have to try it myself.
i want to give them a better look. with no anarchy and the 1/2 price settlers it seems you could switch to republic for a turn or 2 and crank out a ton of settlers in industrial. with religion, a barracks, and legions a semi early rush could work, or with the right wonder and 40 hammer courthouses a cultural solution could work. hmmm.
how did the game turn out last night madD? your egyptians were on a real role but the americans were keeping up in tech when i left. i couldn't have been less of a factor. i knew right away when i found my first hut 5 squares away, only to have the a.i. aztec grab it. my second hut in the other direction was snatched by the other egyptian. with only 20 gold to start rome's expansion plans are ruined. i know col for irrigation is not eqitable but i figured you were about to get it anyways and i still needed 2 techs to get to medieval. if i hadn't been rome you would have got the free trading post and collosus would have been a beast.
I won that game. (no surprise).
your romans and the egyptians won a few fights that they really should not have, but it wouldn't have been to far before they were gone.
del kept trying to camp me but it wasn't hard to get rid of those units.
rubber is actually quite common on most maps and you'd be the only one that can use it for most of the game.
and well, starting with a resource in your capital area can be very helpful (depending on which one).
This really only works for Fundamentalism because it's the only government that provides a bonus during your turn as opposed to at the end of your turn. I guess you could switch to Democracy to up your beaker count to get to the point where you can rush a tech with a Great Scientist, but that's not going to come up often.
Getting the Magna Carta is pretty great with India because then you can have a lot of culture by building cheap Courthouses instead of (or in addition to) Temples. Half price settlers is nice, but kind of pales in comparison to the American bonus. And of course, you'd probably rather have cheap Libraries than cheap Courthouses. If there are no Arabs around, you will almost certainly get the +1 culture bonus for getting Religion first, which doesn't suck at all.
So not a bad civ. The access to all resources bonus can start to be pretty good once you hit medieval. They are also the only civ that will have a special resource next to the capitol without having to move settlers. I think the best I've done on that count is having a Whale. Cattle is pretty darn good too.
i really wanted to see that earlier mongol v roman game play out. your knights probably would have ran me down but i was teching pretty fast and might have got riflemen in time. i made a mistake of rushing a granery in rome early to grow it when i should have used the money to rush settlers on a couple islands. when i reinvited you my screened went instantly black and then reset to the ps3 main menu. i thought that civ finally killed my ps3.
I was the other Egyptian player. I was waiting about 30 minutes to find a game in ranked FFA with no luck. I decided to try just the unranked and saw you guys in there. A couple of good experienced players I thought to myself. Time to pull up my socks. Deluku was the American player. I dont know if he is on these boards but I see him in the top 5 for ranked FFA. So I used my favorite civ. Egyptians. I had only 1 desert in sight and didnt want to go searching with you guys playing so I settled first turn. Stonehenge...great..strike 1. I grabbed a friendly hut and the hut that Danchan was talking about.My only 2 huts of the game. When I took that barb hut Danchan was in my vision. Great. Sure enough he had a warrior army at my door in the next 3-4 turns. I had to use the gold from the huts to rush archers and had an archer army when he attacked. He then camped on my desert. I had no warriors as I lost them to Aztecs. I built a library to get to IW faster to try to get him off my land. By that time MD and Deluku were way up in techs. The GW wonder wasnt available to me so I rushed HG with the GB to at least give me some more squares to use. I never even got the 100g settler. Under too much pressure right away. I lost a couple of key even battles against MD's armies a 9vs9 and a 6vs6. Although that would of just stalled the inevitable. Then my archer army put a ridiculous 15 vs 30 beatdown on his cat army. I got upgraded to vet then his legion army beat that uninjured vet archer army. I just laughed..justice. Anyways it was fun playing you guys. I enjoyed the challenge and hope to play you again. Playing good players helps a lot more to get your game up to snuffdanthechan..... how did the game turn out last night madD? your egyptians were on a real role but the americans were keeping up in tech when i left. i couldn't have been less of a factor. i knew right away when i found my first hut 5 squares away, only to have the a.i. aztec grab it. my second hut in the other direction was snatched by the other egyptian. with only 20 gold to start rome's expansion plans are ruined. i know col for irrigation is not eqitable but i figured you were about to get it anyways and i still needed 2 techs to get to medieval. if i hadn't been rome you would have got the free trading post and collosus would have been a beast.
2 Hours Ago 11:36 AM
I had the Col. and 3 deserts to start.
my 2nd city had another 3 deserts + water.
Del did keep camping my deserts so I had to spend time building units to clear him off.