i will not attempt to deal with this issue using zef's diplomatic rhetoric which he had primarily used until we told him that he was too nice i will try to refrain from polemic and hidden ad hominem arguments as much as possible.
another quick foreword:
my position is that my relativism has little influence on my ability to construct arguments and value some things over others. you may disagree with that but for the time being it would be cool if you could just treat my arguments as though they were not written by a relativist.
i could not make that kind of video about palestinians because their violence towards jews is not statistly institutionalized. in my mind, the muslim killers are terrorists and israeli killers are servants of the state and of an unjust system. you may disagree with that but i only say this in order to illustrate the point that violence is not the same on both sides.
are you sure? what about christian african nations and east asian nations such as china, thailand, and north korea? on the basis of the news i read daily i wouldn't necessarily discern those in regard to the scale of human rights abuses.The vast majority of human rights abuses are committed in Islamic or totalitarian states.
this may be true, and you have insisted on this fact many times, but i mostly fail to see the relevance of this fact. what conclusion should we draw from it? that we should support israel over muslims? shouldn't our goal be to either ensure fair treatment of both sides, regardless of their human rights records, or simply choose to not get involved too much? after all, this is no direct concern for israelis and westerners. it's an internal muslim issue and a problem for them.I can assure you the rights of non-Muslims in Islamic countries is practically much less than Muslims in non-Islamic countries.
i agree with you that it is not is not the goal of the state of israel or israelis in general to annihilate muslims, kill them in large numbers, etc., while it is for a group of muslims that shouldn't be underestimated. what we shouldn't overestimate, however, is how large these muslim groups actually are. 2%? 10%? 70% of all muslims? as much as i am informed, questionnaires result in numbers clearly below 50% which fits with my perception of turks and other descendants of muslims i know who now live here and with my view of humans in general. if you posit that the number is larger what is your basis for that claim?Take away Israel's weapons, what happens? They all get murdered. Take away all of the Arab world's weapons, what happens? Nothing. Israel isn't trying to dominate or annihilate its neighbors while the Arab world is openly seeking Israel's annihilation. This is an open fact.
i think if the number was 1% that would be sufficient for killing all israelis if they got rid of all their weapons in an instant. therefore, i find the equation a little misleading. i probably agree, though, that the palestinian situation would actually better itself if all muslims laid down all weapons immediately.
but another very important question here is why there is fundamentalism in the middle east and why a large group of muslims is ready to kill? you posit that it's due to views internal to islam and muslim dispositional characteristics. while i wouldn't entirely turn down that claim my view would rather be that it's due to perceptions of great injustice and that religion is rather used as a tool to fuel and justify rage. so it is not insignificant. but if it had been chinese buddhists who had settled in palestine and had behaved exactly like the state of israel does, i think the issue would've been largely the same. the fact that there is historic and religious animosity i think only contributed marginally as real issues are geographical and geopolitical. if these issues don't exist, religious enemies get along, such as jews and chistians today.
how do you think we can resolve that issue and determine who is right?
i agree that fundamentalist tendencies in the muslim world also have to be dealt with internally.It's just that simple & until that issue (the teaching of annihilation as a valid relational concept) is dealt with, there is no peace possible. In that conclusion, the film is correct. Only if both sides accept the right to exist can peace even be approached.
the right to exist is a complicated issue. from a muslim perspective, i somewhat understand why they don't want to admit israel's right to exist as this would be equal to admitting historical defeat and concession. of course, they don't have a choice but to accept israel's existence. everyone knows that, even the israelis. therefore, i find that issue mostly arbitrary. no nation requires a right to exist, they just do. it seems to me that the israeli state is only insisting on public statements about that right in order to not negotiate. israel and palestine need not necessarily be friends in order to negotiate but i agree that it would probably make it easier. so there's definitely incentive for palestinian officials to publicly voice their support for israel's right to exist.