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Thread: Civ 5 starts fine; becomes unbearably slow

  1. #1
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    Civ 5 starts fine; becomes unbearably slow

    System: Dell Precision M4400, 4GB RAM, NVidia Quadro FX 1700M, Windows 7 (64 bit)

    Game starts up fine; even plays fine for a handful of turns; then gradually makes the entire systemn painfully tortuously slow (not just the game; everything in Windows). Task Manager is no help - CPU is being used sensibly; still plenty of physical RAM left (this happens whether Civ 5 is the only app of consequence running or whether I have a ton of stuff going on).

    Am running in Windowed mode so I can use my secondary display for other things.

    Any hints? I got the latest NVidia driver but it didn't do squat.

    Thanks,
    M1EK

  2. #2
    A workstation like this may not be suited for gaming.

    Can you post a dxdiag

  3. #3
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    dxdiag is below. IMO, doesn't explain why the game works fine for 5-10 turns and then becomes unbearable. (My standards for performance here are very loose; I'm not looking for great graphics speed; but the entire machine slows to a crawl).

    ------------------
    System Information
    ------------------
    Time of this report: 10/18/2010, 15:49:41
    Machine name: xxxxxxxx
    Operating System: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit (6.1, Build 7600) (7600.win7_gdr.100618-1621)
    Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
    System Manufacturer: Dell Inc.
    System Model: Precision M4400
    BIOS: Phoenix ROM BIOS PLUS Version 1.10 A11
    Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Extreme CPU Q9300 @ 2.53GHz (2 CPUs), ~2.5GHz
    Memory: 4096MB RAM
    Available OS Memory: 4084MB RAM
    Page File: 2846MB used, 5318MB available
    Windows Dir: C:\Windows
    DirectX Version: DirectX 11
    DX Setup Parameters: Not found
    User DPI Setting: Using System DPI
    System DPI Setting: 96 DPI (100 percent)
    DWM DPI Scaling: Disabled
    DxDiag Version: 6.01.7600.16385 64bit Unicode

    ------------
    DxDiag Notes
    ------------
    Display Tab 1: No problems found.
    Display Tab 2: No problems found.
    Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
    Input Tab: No problems found.

    --------------------
    DirectX Debug Levels
    --------------------
    Direct3D: 0/4 (retail)
    DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
    DirectInput: 0/5 (retail)
    DirectMusic: 0/5 (retail)
    DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
    DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
    DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)

    ---------------
    Display Devices
    ---------------
    Card name: NVIDIA Quadro FX 1700M
    Manufacturer: NVIDIA
    Chip type: Quadro FX 1700M
    DAC type: Integrated RAMDAC
    Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_065A&SUBSYS_02501028&REV_A1
    Display Memory: 2281 MB
    Dedicated Memory: 495 MB
    Shared Memory: 1785 MB
    Current Mode: 1920 x 1200 (32 bit) (60Hz)
    Monitor Name: Generic PnP Monitor
    Monitor Model: unknown
    Monitor Id: SEC5443
    Native Mode: 1920 x 1200(p) (59.998Hz)
    Output Type: Internal
    Driver Name: nvd3dumx.dll,nvwgf2umx.dll,nvwgf2umx.dll,nvd3dum,n vwgf2um,nvwgf2um
    Driver File Version: 8.17.0012.5896 (English)
    Driver Version: 8.17.12.5896
    DDI Version: 10
    Driver Model: WDDM 1.1
    Driver Attributes: Final Retail
    Driver Date/Size: 7/9/2010 17:38:00, 12471400 bytes
    WHQL Logo'd: n/a
    WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
    Device Identifier: {D7B71E3E-451A-11CF-9064-5C221FC2C535}
    Vendor ID: 0x10DE
    Device ID: 0x065A
    SubSys ID: 0x02501028
    Revision ID: 0x00A1
    Driver Strong Name: oem23.inf:NVIDIA_SetA_Devices.NTamd64.6.1:Section0 20:8.17.12.5896ci

  4. #4
    Quantum always blames the player not the programmers.

    That system should be fine for this game.

    Read back through the threads for the last four or five days. There are MANY long threads on exactly this problem.

    The game is buggy as hell. If you'll read those threads, you'll find some hints that make it possible to play--but it still eventually slows down intolerably.

    The most important rule, it seems to be, is NEVER load from inside the game. Always exit to the Main Menu first.

    Also, every time before starting the game, delete the cache.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordelayne View Post
    Quantum always blames the player not the programmers.

    That system should be fine for this game.

    Read back through the threads for the last four or five days. There are MANY long threads on exactly this problem.

    The game is buggy as hell. If you'll read those threads, you'll find some hints that make it possible to play--but it still eventually slows down intolerably.

    The most important rule, it seems to be, is NEVER load from inside the game. Always exit to the Main Menu first.

    Also, every time before starting the game, delete the cache.
    Can you point to even a SINGLE thread, that details this issue, because i cant, this one is unique to me.

    Also, can you find me a resource, that indicated that a Midrange, mobile, workstation GFX card, would work fine.

    Ive been looking, and i cant determine it conclusively.
    Last edited by QuantumTarantino; 10-18-2010 at 07:03 AM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    Can you point to even a SINGLE thread, that details this issue, because i cant, this one is unique to me.

    Also, can you find me a resource, that indicated that a Midrange, mobile, workstation GFX card, would work fine.

    Ive been looking, and i cant determine it conclusively.
    If it weren't suitable, why does it work just fine for a handful - up to a dozen or more - turns, and only THEN make the entire system unbearably slow?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cordelayne View Post
    Quantum always blames the player not the programmers.

    That system should be fine for this game.

    Read back through the threads for the last four or five days. There are MANY long threads on exactly this problem.

    The game is buggy as hell. If you'll read those threads, you'll find some hints that make it possible to play--but it still eventually slows down intolerably.

    The most important rule, it seems to be, is NEVER load from inside the game. Always exit to the Main Menu first.

    Also, every time before starting the game, delete the cache.
    I've never loaded from inside a game - by that I mean I start up and always load from the main menu that comes up right after the video goes away. Tried deleting the cache once and it made no difference.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by m1ek View Post
    If it weren't suitable, why does it work just fine for a handful - up to a dozen or more - turns, and only THEN make the entire system unbearably slow?
    Its a very good question, the symptoms youre experiencing are very very odd.

  9. #9
    Gosh, from my reading here, I don't think these symptoms are odd or rare. There is obviously a HUGE set of bugs in the Civ5 routines for saving and loading.

    I have a very high end, new rig. I just started a new game, large terra map, just 3 civ opponents and 6 city states, emperor level. I didn't like a result on a goodie hut (aka ancient ruins) so for the very first time I (1) exited to main menu and (2) went to load my save file. Crashed the Civ5 program entirely.

    This is really driving me nuts, since this is my all-time favorite game (by a LARGE margin) for 20 years, and I think this has the potential to be the best version of it (if the AI gets improved), but it is also just about the buggiest program I ever bought.

    If I were a chief programmer on this misadventure, I'd want to be wearing a bag over my head.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordelayne View Post
    Gosh, from my reading here, I don't think these symptoms are odd or rare. There is obviously a HUGE set of bugs in the Civ5 routines for saving and loading.

    I have a very high end, new rig. I just started a new game, large terra map, just 3 civ opponents and 6 city states, emperor level. I didn't like a result on a goodie hut (aka ancient ruins) so for the very first time I (1) exited to main menu and (2) went to load my save file. Crashed the Civ5 program entirely.

    This is really driving me nuts, since this is my all-time favorite game (by a LARGE margin) for 20 years, and I think this has the potential to be the best version of it (if the AI gets improved), but it is also just about the buggiest program I ever bought.

    If I were a chief programmer on this misadventure, I'd want to be wearing a bag over my head.
    Again, please point to ANY other user, who is able to play flawlessly, then after a certain time, the COMPUTER ITSELF gets sluggish
    M1ke isnt reporting crahing, long turns, etc

    Hes reporting a VERY specific problem, which i have not encountered here, nothing that even remotely resembles it in fact.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    Its a very good question, the symptoms youre experiencing are very very odd.
    Not odd to me.

    IRL, I'm a software engineer. If the game is getting slower and slower as the number of turns increases, it's the symptom of design flaws or and coding bugs.

    I have two Civilization V games saved and pending, because I can't finish them due to all the crashes that occur in the endgame. Not mentioning that I need to wait 1 min or more between each turn...

    PC configuration: Intel Quad Core 3GHz, 8Mb memory, SSD 120 Mb disk, NVidia GTX 285 video card. Should be enough for running Civilization, right ?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Trimsic View Post
    Not odd to me.

    IRL, I'm a software engineer. If the game is getting slower and slower as the number of turns increases, it's the symptom of design flaws or and coding bugs.

    I have two Civilization V games saved and pending, because I can't finish them due to all the crashes that occur in the endgame. Not mentioning that I need to wait 1 min or more between each turn...

    PC configuration: Intel Quad Core 3GHz, 8Mb memory, SSD 120 Mb disk, NVidia GTX 285 video card. Should be enough for running Civilization, right ?
    you didnt read his issue though.

    The game is not getting slower and slower as the number of turns increase.

    And no, that shouldnt be enough for running Civ5. Unless you mean GB's
    Even then, i havent seen anyone reporting whether the game reacts favorably to SSD storage
    Last edited by QuantumTarantino; 10-19-2010 at 11:49 AM.

  13. #13
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    As a former D3D driver developer myself, it's my bet that either Civ V or the NVidia driver itself has a memory leak (in video memory) - that's the most logical explanation for what's going on, by the way.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    you didnt read his issue though.

    The game is not getting slower and slower as the number of turns increase.

    And no, that shouldnt be enough for running Civ5. Unless you mean GB's
    Even then, i havent seen anyone reporting whether the game reacts favorably to SSD storage
    What are you reading? That is exacly what he wrote: "Game starts up fine; even plays fine for a handful of turns; then gradually makes the entire systemn painfully tortuously slow (not just the game; everything in Windows)."

    I registered just to say I have exactly the same problem running the game on minimum settings.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    you didnt read his issue though.

    The game is not getting slower and slower as the number of turns increase.

    And no, that shouldnt be enough for running Civ5. Unless you mean GB's
    Even then, i havent seen anyone reporting whether the game reacts favorably to SSD storage
    Sure GB, not MB

    So, my exact configuration is:
    - Intel Quad Core 3GHz
    - 8 Gb memory - DDR2 1066MHz
    - Geforce GTX 285
    - 120 GB SSD disk

    I don't expect the game to run smoothly just because I have an SSD disk.
    But I didn't expect either such a poor performance of the game when it's running on my system.

    The facts are:
    - poor scrolling performance at the endgame, and globally a very slow refresh of the game tiles
    - surprising long wait time when the AI is running its turn, and by the way very poor AI
    - game crash at the endgame, especially with the DirectX 11 version
    - game stops responding for 1 minute or more when capturing a city, as if it were spending all that time in rebuilding internal tables

    You may refuse to see the reality as it is experienced by people like me, but that will not transform this reality into something that's pure imagination

  16. #16
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    What if it was written oh my God what if it was written in Dot Net?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Trimsic View Post

    You may refuse to see the reality as it is experienced by people like me, but that will not transform this reality into something that's pure imagination
    Can you please point out one place where i am "refusing to see the reality" please?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    Can you please point out one place where i am "refusing to see the reality" please?
    It happens to ME, as well. You don't need people to point you to "one place" because a number of people have said that it affects them as well!

    It starts off smooth for me, and after a while it starts to chug. This has been pointed out in NUMEROUS posts, if you can't find them it's your own issue. Stop trying to say that it only happens to this guy, and that it is rare or odd, because it isn't. That is one of the cardinal complaints that people have about this game!

  19. #19
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    I'd also like to say to anybody having issues running the DX10/11 version of the game, if you try it out on the DX9 version it runs slightly better. I don't have the huge waits I used to, but the game looks dreadful.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Gukkmaw View Post
    It happens to ME, as well. You don't need people to point you to "one place" because a number of people have said that it affects them as well!

    It starts off smooth for me, and after a while it starts to chug. This has been pointed out in NUMEROUS posts, if you can't find them it's your own issue. Stop trying to say that it only happens to this guy, and that it is rare or odd, because it isn't. That is one of the cardinal complaints that people have about this game!
    Im not, if youd read what i said, i have said what is happening to THIS guy, is NOT whats happening to you.

    This issue, AS POSTED BY THE OP, is unique.

    NOONE ELSE, had reported that the entire PC is getting hammered.

    Game Slowdown is NOT PC Slowdown

  21. #21
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    I expect many people seeing the chugging are having the whole system slow down and don't know it (I'm running multimon at my desk at my lunch hour at work, which is how I can tell that the whole system gets slow). It remains slow for a while after finally existing Civ V though, so maybe you could ask people about that... (poor mouse responsiveness, appalling response time in other windows, etc).

  22. #22
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    I'd recommend restarting the OS after something like that. It could be as innocuous as a thorough garbage collection, but it could also be corrupt or leaked memory. This could cause message calls to queues and stacks to slow down or even fail altogether.

  23. #23
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    To the OP:

    You said you were trying to run duel monitors. I think I've read where that doesn't work right with Civ V. Last night I tried it to see if my old monitor had a graphical glitch I was experiencing. When I started the game up with duel monitors in Windows, the intro videos of the game were extremely choppy. I didn't try playing the game. I just wanted to look at the menus. Even after I disabled my old monitor, and tried to run the game normally, the game was still choppy in the videos. I had to reboot my machine to get rid of it. Try turning off duel monitors. If that doesn't work, then try rebooting with duel monitors disabled, and then try the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trimsic View Post
    IRL, I'm a software engineer. If the game is getting slower and slower as the number of turns increases, it's the symptom of design flaws or and coding bugs.
    Whhaa?

    As the turn count increases, Civs and CS's get larger. The larger they are, the more processing required for the AI to take its turn, because the AI has more to consider, the more 'game pieces' there are in the game. Doesn't take a programmer to know that.
    Last edited by Pulseczar; 10-21-2010 at 09:04 PM.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pulseczar View Post
    As the turn count increases, Civs and CS's get larger. The larger they are, the more processing required for the AI to take its turn, because the AI has more to consider, the more 'game pieces' there are in the game. Doesn't take a programmer to know that.
    Except that this happens even at the very beginning of the game - last time I tried a new game, I went with standard map; played about 5-6 turns, and then had to exit because it turned glacial again (whole system; not just Civ V). It's the amount of turns, not the time in the game when the turns happen, that seems to make the most difference. Memory leak is the most likely cause here, but it could be the game OR the video driver.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by m1ek View Post
    It's the amount of turns, not the time in the game when the turns happen, that seems to make the most difference.
    Not following you. Each date in the game directly corresponds to a turn number. 2050 is always turn 500.

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Pulseczar View Post
    Not following you. Each date in the game directly corresponds to a turn number. 2050 is always turn 500.
    Thats not true
    You can set your "timeframe" marathon has many many more turns, for example

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pulseczar View Post
    Not following you. Each date in the game directly corresponds to a turn number. 2050 is always turn 500.
    You misunderstand. No matter whether I start at turn 1 or start playing a saved game at turn 100 or 500, the performance for the first few turns after that is fine; but it starts to degrade dramatically after a handful more, and then the entire system is swamped.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by m1ek View Post
    You misunderstand. No matter whether I start at turn 1 or start playing a saved game at turn 100 or 500, the performance for the first few turns after that is fine; but it starts to degrade dramatically after a handful more, and then the entire system is swamped.
    I see. I haven't experienced that type of slow-down.

    The recent patch seems to have really helped turn time for me. I think I'm actually going to be able to finish (no crash) an Earth-Huge map that I started when the patch was released. I'm around 1950, and the game hasn't slowed down at all hardly. I really hope they've fixed it, because, to me, the large Earth games are one of the most appealing ways to play the game.

  29. #29
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    I too have noticed a system slug period after 20-30 minutes of play.

    I will try to delete the cache.

    Can someone tell me how?

    Thanks.

    -.-

  30. #30
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    Does anyone else get the horrible pauses at the leader diplomacy screens where it often takes the leaders several if not tens of seconds before they finally start moving and talking, and it often isn't synched up?

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by aeligos View Post
    I too have noticed a system slug period after 20-30 minutes of play.

    I will try to delete the cache.

    Can someone tell me how?

    Thanks.

    -.-
    http://lmgtfy.com/?q=delete+cache+civ+5

  32. #32
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    So finally got to try this a little bit in fullscreen (disconnected from docking station and external monitor) and my recollection was incorrect; it in fact works a lot better in this mode (slows down eventually but more like 20-30 turns from each start rather than the handful it takes when running multi-mon).

  33. #33
    Similar problems with severe slow down. Seems to happen after a "cut scene" (ie. meeting with a political leader), or sometimes visiting the city screen etc. seem to trigger it, so not just a period of play issue.

  34. #34
    Very occasionally it seems to right itself, but usually I have to complete quit Civ then restart and realod the game, which is a 2-3 minute progress.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    Its a very good question, the symptoms youre experiencing are very very odd.
    For "odd" symptoms they seem to be endemic to this game. Who are you defending, Quantum, the game or the programmers?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    Again, please point to ANY other user, who is able to play flawlessly, then after a certain time, the COMPUTER ITSELF gets sluggish
    M1ke isnt reporting crahing, long turns, etc

    Hes reporting a VERY specific problem, which i have not encountered here, nothing that even remotely resembles it in fact.
    First of all, I am a player who plays flawlessly, only to observe the game bog itself down. Specifically, each unit takes an increasing amount of time to take its turn, which culminates in an exponentially-long turn overall. This makes the game unplayable for me, which is a heartbreaker because I've been playing Civ from Day One.

    Secondly, I question your motive in folding the "specific problem," of the OP into your defense of this game and its programmers. I feel you are using it to distract posters from the main point, that this game becomes so slow it is unplayable after a certain amount of time. The only reasons you could have to defend the indefensible flaws in this game's programming are, either you are so in love with the franchise you will take a bullet for it, or you are associated in some way with it on a level which is above "player."

    Quote Originally Posted by QuantumTarantino View Post
    you didnt read his issue though.

    The game is not getting slower and slower as the number of turns increase.

    And no, that shouldnt be enough for running Civ5. Unless you mean GB's
    Even then, i havent seen anyone reporting whether the game reacts favorably to SSD storage
    I read his issue. And, by the way, the game gets slower and slower as turns increase. This game was put out too early, for whatever reason. The only reason I can imagine why such a prestigious franchise would ram a game through development is financial, and does not reflect well on anyone involved.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by m1ek View Post
    System: Dell Precision M4400, 4GB RAM, NVidia Quadro FX 1700M, Windows 7 (64 bit)

    Game starts up fine; even plays fine for a handful of turns; then gradually makes the entire systemn painfully tortuously slow (not just the game; everything in Windows). Task Manager is no help - CPU is being used sensibly; still plenty of physical RAM left (this happens whether Civ 5 is the only app of consequence running or whether I have a ton of stuff going on).

    Am running in Windowed mode so I can use my secondary display for other things.

    Any hints? I got the latest NVidia driver but it didn't do squat.

    Thanks,
    M1EK
    Too many AI calculations may be eating up too much time as all the AI players multiply with units and actions against each other. Try this and see if it improves your performance: Duel Map, Modern Era, no barbarians, no city states and just ONE AI player.

  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by HugoDeGroot View Post
    For "odd" symptoms they seem to be endemic to this game. Who are you defending, Quantum, the game or the programmers?



    First of all, I am a player who plays flawlessly, only to observe the game bog itself down. Specifically, each unit takes an increasing amount of time to take its turn, which culminates in an exponentially-long turn overall. This makes the game unplayable for me, which is a heartbreaker because I've been playing Civ from Day One.

    Secondly, I question your motive in folding the "specific problem," of the OP into your defense of this game and its programmers. I feel you are using it to distract posters from the main point, that this game becomes so slow it is unplayable after a certain amount of time. The only reasons you could have to defend the indefensible flaws in this game's programming are, either you are so in love with the franchise you will take a bullet for it, or you are associated in some way with it on a level which is above "player."



    I read his issue. And, by the way, the game gets slower and slower as turns increase. This game was put out too early, for whatever reason. The only reason I can imagine why such a prestigious franchise would ram a game through development is financial, and does not reflect well on anyone involved.
    You dont seem to have a grasp of the english language, nor the ability to read.

    Again, for the 4th or 5th time, the issue the OP brought up, is NOT the slowdown as the game advances issue

  38. #38
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    Let get back on topic. I will point the Op to this site. http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-...M.17671.0.html

    NVIDIA Quadro FX 1700M

    The Nvidia Quadro FX 1700M is a professional graphics adapter for CAD and 3D applications. It is based on the G96 core (GeForce 9650M e.g.) but with different drivers, that are optimized for OpenGL and professional applications. The drivers are zertified to work flawlessly with different applications.

    To me This really sounds like it Made for Cad not Computer gaming. Even if this Card can run games it will not be as fast as a Game Card like the Geforce 9650m Just due to the differnt Drivers.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pulseczar View Post
    lol thats funny, mostly because the google search brought me back to this thread and post :P

  40. #40
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    Everything Slows Down

    Typing in textboxes in firefox, textpad, etc... even lags. Within minutes of turning on Civ5 the temperature on the graphics card rises 10 degrees celsius.

    I have a g250 card, i7 860, and 8 Gigs of ram. No other game has ever tried to melt my machine.

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