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Thread: The Fall Patch: One More Thing

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    The Fall Patch: One More Thing

    Hey guys,

    There was one more thing that I didn't mention that's coming with the fall patch. It was originally in the notes but I took it out because I didn't think you guys would care, but maybe you do?

    The DLL source code will be released with the fall patch, allowing modders to compile modified DLLs for their Civilization V mods.

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    Gee, just a minor detail of no consequence hey..

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K Greg View Post
    Hey guys,

    There was one more thing that I didn't mention that's coming with the fall patch. It was originally in the notes but I took it out because I didn't think you guys would care, but maybe you do?

    The DLL source code will be released with the fall patch, allowing modders to compile modified DLLs for their Civilization V mods.
    You must think you are so clever.

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    Oh that Greg, such a mischievous chap...

    Good news, though

    PS: Waiting to see who asks the obvious question, though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lietkynes View Post
    You must think you are so clever.
    I really do

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    Quote Originally Posted by sambc View Post
    ps: Waiting to see who asks the obvious question, though.
    must
    resist


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    Hmm.

    When do we get news on the new DLC civs?

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    Any word on pitboss? (Just asking as it was originally announced as coming along with the DLL way back when). Great news regardless. Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by istry555 View Post
    Any word on pitboss? (Just asking as it was originally announced as coming along with the DLL way back when). Great news regardless. Thanks!
    Negative. Also, I don't believe it was ever announced as such!

    Between the two, getting the DLL source out was a higher priority than pitboss, which is now being worked on.

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    Greg is right, Pitboss and the DLL were announced at the same time, but it was never stated that they would be released at the same time.

    Anyways, this should help modders quite a bit.

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    Yay! We'll finally get Civ5's version of Fall From Heaven and all those other awesome mods. Maybe Kruelgor can get that Rome mod working.

    Question: Does this mean we won't get any more DLC/expansions?

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    Awesome!! Thanks for the news.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Gate of Mordor View Post
    Yay! We'll finally get Civ5's version of Fall From Heaven and all those other awesome mods. Maybe Kruelgor can get that Rome mod working.

    Question: Does this mean we won't get any more DLC/expansions?
    There'll never be a Civ V version of Fall from Heaven - setting as its creator now works for Stardock. Also, anything remotely comparable will most likely take years to complete - and that depends largely on whether or not modders decide to make the switch from IV to V.

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    Great! Great news! Long live to the modder community!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K Greg View Post
    Negative. Also, I don't believe it was ever announced as such!

    Between the two, getting the DLL source out was a higher priority than pitboss, which is now being worked on.
    True, it was never said they were to be released together, but were said to be many months away, nearly 10 months.
    When you say "pitboss, which is now being worked on" do you mean they are starting it now the source is done, or did they start back 10 months ago with the orgininal announcement?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K Greg View Post
    Negative.
    You've been playing too much XCOM.

    BTW, ☺☺☺ DLL?

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    Do you plan to implement MODs support in MP too?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Olek View Post
    When you say "pitboss, which is now being worked on" do you mean they are starting it now the source is done, or did they start back 10 months ago with the orgininal announcement?
    If it's "now" being worked on it means that it wasn't worked on before. They just started.
    Which explains why Greg could not answer even the most basic questions about it.
    So summer 2013 it is.

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    Great news! Civ5 will finally reach its full potential as a modding platform now.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by lietkynes View Post
    If it's "now" being worked on it means that it wasn't worked on before. They just started.
    Which explains why Greg could not answer even the most basic questions about it.
    So summer 2013 it is.
    Even if your semantic guesswork is right (big IF), assuming it would take another year is faulty logic. Even if they started working on it now (big IF), it might arrive by the next patch or DLC, depending on difficulty of implementation.

    Of course, those big IF's are probably wrong. I imagine they've been working on both this whole time.

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    I don't follow the summer 2013 prediction. The statement in the OP is pretty straightforward. I doubt that they would make such a very specific prediction unless they were certain, given the heat they have taken for earlier statements that were not so specific.

    Of course, it's possible that 2K is working behind the scenes to overthrow the US government. "2K Greg" is really just a plant here to start a revolt among Civ5 modders (which we will later learn was just a clever diversion).

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    Quote Originally Posted by lietkynes View Post
    If it's "now" being worked on it means that it wasn't worked on before. They just started.
    Which explains why Greg could not answer even the most basic questions about it.
    So summer 2013 it is.
    We've been working on it for a while

  23. #23
    Any news on any DLC Greggy?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2K Greg View Post
    We've been working on it for a while
    Wow, we are that close to release that you are finally allowed to talk ?
    Excellent news, thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stethnorun View Post
    assuming it would take another year is faulty logic.
    It's not faulty logic because it was not logical reasoning, I was just trying to lure Greg since he's all talkative now after months of silence.

    It's impossible for any of us to make any kind of accurate predictions on stuff like that, we lack all the basic information that are needed to make such a prediction. TBH I am surprised that I have to explain this lol.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by lietkynes View Post
    It's not faulty logic because it was not logical reasoning, I was just trying to lure Greg since he's all talkative now after months of silence.

    It's impossible for any of us to make any kind of accurate predictions on stuff like that, we lack all the basic information that are needed to make such a prediction. TBH I am surprised that I have to explain this lol.
    Sorry, I take people at face value. I'm not cynical enough to know when people have ulterior motives.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stethnorun View Post
    Sorry, I take people at face value. I'm not cynical enough to know when people have ulterior motives.
    Also you lack irony apparently, next time I will be sure to put a nice smiley () next to my sentence, so you don't miss it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lietkynes View Post
    ... I was just trying to lure Greg since he's all talkative now after months of silence.
    Yeah, 'cos Greg definitely seems like the type to fall for baiting.

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    Btw, Greg can we expect a new civ DLC also alongside this patch ?

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    - Hang on...What else was in this patch update? I think I missed the first notification of this, can someone post a link?

    And I, too, would like to know if there will be a DLC soon. Do you know of any upcoming DLCs, Greg?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    - Hang on...What else was in this patch update? I think I missed the first notification of this, can someone post a link?

    And I, too, would like to know if there will be a DLC soon. Do you know of any upcoming DLCs, Greg?
    Nevermind, found it...But still would like to know about any DLCs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    Nevermind, found it...But still would like to know about any DLCs.
    I'd prefer to know if releasing this code PREVENTS them from making new civs. If that's the case, GRRRRRRRRRRR. But still, I'd love to see some awesome mods.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Gate of Mordor View Post
    I'd prefer to know if releasing this code PREVENTS them from making new civs. If that's the case, GRRRRRRRRRRR. But still, I'd love to see some awesome mods.
    No it will not. Even if they release the dll they still own the game and can do whatever they please as far as releasing dlc civs etc. The release of the dlls will make it easier for modders to add their own unique civs but firaxis will still release the "official civs".

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    Very sad that Pitboss won't be coming soon but pleased that we've at least had some confirmation that it will come in the future. I'm not sure I'd agree that the DLL will be used my more people (including those who use the created mods), I think that the number of people who would use a proper turn based multiplayer version of the game is far higher than 2k seems to credit.

  35. Quote Originally Posted by callan View Post
    Very sad that Pitboss won't be coming soon but pleased that we've at least had some confirmation that it will come in the future. I'm not sure I'd agree that the DLL will be used my more people (including those who use the created mods), I think that the number of people who would use a proper turn based multiplayer version of the game is far higher than 2k seems to credit.
    I think they would have a better idea of that than you. They run metrics for these things. It's a business, after all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stethnorun View Post
    I think they would have a better idea of that than you. They run metrics for these things. It's a business, after all.
    This.

    IMHO Multiplayer has a small audience in Civ, otherwise 2K would have cared a lot more. 2K is a business and it's in it for the money after all. The fact that MP has been so neglected is a clear indicator that the player base for it is not as big as we would like to think.

    I am starting to think that maybe they should ignore MP completely in Civ6. I mean, most games come with a functional multiplayer from the beginning while Civ5 MP (2 years after release) is still a work in progress. They clearly don't have the resources to handle it properly so maybe if you can't do it well it's better not to do it at all and focus all effort on SP.

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    I wouldn't buy a CIV game without any MP functionality and I'm sure that there are more MP players out there than you think. Even if we are 2 years after release we should expect MP improvements to come rather than wishing for MP to be thrown away. I always had fun playing against human players and would like to continue to do so.

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    One could argue that the lack of initial support for multiplayer is exactly the reason it doesn't have a large multiplayer following. If we had a queue system with pre-set game options teaming players up against each other via a ranking system like most other games do, then it would be a bit more accessible I think.

    Having said that, I really don't see a future for any multiplayer turn-based games. Realtime and multiplayer works - turnbased... not so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stethnorun View Post
    I think they would have a better idea of that than you. They run metrics for these things. It's a business, after all.
    It's my business too. Not that my opinion would be disqualified if it weren't. There is no "one indivisible metric" to measure people's appetite for something you have not provided. The fact of the matter is that they attempted to implement the notoriously difficult synchronous turn model utilising a deterministic AI which, in hindsight, was a massive design flaw because it was not achievable with the resources they had. It crippled any chance Civ5 had of being regarded as a serious MP game because it just did not work. In all honesty it barely works now, 2 years later. What little resources that have gone into MP in the intervening period have only been in the realm of fixing the worst bugs, there has been 0 new functionality or framework improvements, a systematic failure stemming from the original design flaw mentioned above.

    So tell me, how do invent a metric to measure the effect of all that? If you find the answer don't tell me though, you'll be able to sell it for millions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by callan View Post
    It's my business too. Not that my opinion would be disqualified if it weren't. There is no "one indivisible metric" to measure people's appetite for something you have not provided. The fact of the matter is that they attempted to implement the notoriously difficult synchronous turn model utilising a deterministic AI which, in hindsight, was a massive design flaw because it was not achievable with the resources they had. It crippled any chance Civ5 had of being regarded as a serious MP game because it just did not work. In all honesty it barely works now, 2 years later. What little resources that have gone into MP in the intervening period have only been in the realm of fixing the worst bugs, there has been 0 new functionality or framework improvements, a systematic failure stemming from the original design flaw mentioned above.

    So tell me, how do invent a metric to measure the effect of all that? If you find the answer don't tell me though, you'll be able to sell it for millions.
    The problems is STEAM integration. They just wanted to migrate to STEAM with minimal cost so they cut all functions that they can. I think that current model was just the easier to implement using STEAM API.

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