Sure, alienate the paying customer base then blame it on pirates. The suits are so clever.
They're full of ****, yes. I hope all the hate we send them poison them irremediably and takes them through a long and painful death.
Sure, alienate the paying customer base then blame it on pirates. The suits are so clever.
They're full of ****, yes. I hope all the hate we send them poison them irremediably and takes them through a long and painful death.
What I said was.. answer the questions, then lock the thread.
There are a lot of valid questions in this thread that deserve more than a vague answer.
2K are idiots - Valve can handle pirates via Steam and show everyone how its done and yet these guys make a royal cockup. Bravo!
I also just signed in to say a big F**K YOU 2K.
I am glad the game comes out later in Europe, so I had the time to find out about this. One sale down the drain, thanks to whoever had the brilliant idea of this securom/activation mess.
Glad I am leaving on vacation next month, so I will just forget about this game for now, and hopefully all this crap will have gone away when I get back.
Steam is also DO NOT WANT. The RIGHT to resell games is very important.Originally Posted by Viz79
I doubt you will get any legit answers from this.
The whole thing is a frustrating waste of time. Hackers are smarter than developers and this game is already available to download for FREE on any torrent website - hacked and cracked.
Well, I'm really sad that I did not read this thread before I went to the games convention, or else I would have caused a bigger fuzz.
I'm working over an hour now informing as much european sites as possible. AFAIK there is a Bioshock launch next week and it would be a shame if we do not inform as much cutomerr as possible what they really get for their money.
Beside it is against some laws limiting the useage without any hint on the box and It may even be against the law installing an all time active rootkit without any acceptance from the user - at least in the EU.
The only thing missing is a nice hacker misusing the rootkit for more carnage. Are 2k then responsible for causing a security breach and data loss? Who is responsible for any problems with the rootkit?
As you can guess, I won`t buy bioshock in it's current ill state and I am happy that you did inform us about it. Thanks a lot!
Im memory of a once been a nice software dev team: I will install system shock 2.
Does the Steam version include this stupid activation?
I have been reading through this entire thread for a few days, and I need to a) vent and b) correct some horribly uninformed idiots who are talking about legal matters they obviously know less than nothing about. I am, in fact, an intellectual property attorney. I'm not about to offer unsolicited legal advice in a public forum such as this, but there have been too many misstatements here to let it slide.
First, cracks ARE illegal. Read the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, enacted in 1998 by the U.S. Congress. It is a horrible law, enacted by ☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺ and corporate puppets, but it is still law. Read Section 1201, on the "Circumvention of copyright protection systems."
Second, to all of you idiots who are asserting that 2k or any other software creator / publisher don't have the right to do "X" because you bought the game and it's "your property": stop clinging to your battered copies of Ayn Rand and libertarian pamphlets, and pay attention. While I agree with your ideals (I really do), you're overlooking 20 years of systematic ☺☺☺☺☺☺☺ over of consumers in favor of copyright producers--the software companies. Try reading the next EULA you click past, and you'll discover that NONE OF YOU HAVE BOUGHT THE GAME. What you have purchased is a "license." The game and even the media it comes on is still the property of the software company. This sucks, I hate it, I became a lawyer to fight ☺☺☺☺ like it, but so far I'm losing and so are you.
Finally, to Elizabeth 2k and your employer: you are totally within your legal rights to attempt to protect your property in the manner which you have implemented. You are also alienating your customers and creating an enormous disincentive for those of us who wish to enjoy your fantastic game legally, paying you to do so. Please take your collective head out of your collective ass and FIX THIS so that you can claim the critical AND financial success that Bioshock would otherwise warrant.
J. Gravitas
Yes steam version requires activation through securom too
Yep.
And again guys spread the word far and wide, tell people not to buy this game, I have let everyone I know on 14 different forum boards and all my friends in the games I play and personal friends not to buy this game.
Not worth 50 bucks when you can only install it 2 times then your screwed..
2kgames have seriously let down their customers, boycott it until it is fixed aka remove this stupid 2 activation crap, put some other type of security but get rid of this crap.
definately not getting my 50.00 nor any of my friends currently right now. so far I have spread the word to over 15,000 people (forums) personal friends and game friends. so 2kgames just lost 750,000 dollars give or take a few thousand more or less.
Yes, steam is also infested with that activation.
Btw. There is a 6 GB pirated Copy on the net, it it looks like the real and CP-free stuff inkl. keygen.
IF this is true, why does 2k torture their customers with that ineffectice CP? Should I include a picture of my original SystemShock2 CD to proof that games get bought even without copy protection?
There is no working crack as of now
Thats a lie. Several other forums have confirmed that there are working cracks in the wild.
Looks like the pirates get to play the game and yet I wont
Actually you are wrong. The game was cracked over 12 hours ago.
@JGravitas
Well in the EU are some laws different, if there is no hint about the special activation process at the box you could expect a lifetime key. Which means you can get your money back if that should be profen untrue (even opened).
For example, I brought back over 12 audio-cd's just because they did not mention any CP on the back cover (esp. that SONY ones). -> CP makes it unplayable -> brought back and got my money back.
Even though, it would save a lot fair gamers a lot trouble if they know what they face by buying that crappy CP.
Not all of us live in the US. No UCITA in the UK yet.
Doctrine of first sale and the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002 are still alive and kicking here.
Calling people idiots is not the way to go if you want to get your point across.
Whether you are who you presume to be there is also rights as a paying customer and solicitors to back that up too so dont act that your the one in the right.
We deserve to be as angry as we like, given that we have paid for a FANTASTIC game that we cannot play.
Maybe you need to read:
The prohibition contained in subparagraph (A) shall not apply to persons who are users of a copyrighted work which is in a particular class of works, if such persons are, or are likely to be in the succeeding 3-year period, adversely affected by virtue of such prohibition in their ability to make noninfringing uses of that particular class of works under this title, as determined under subparagraph (C).
Free Use fella
I am not an attorney but I did stay at a holiday inn express last night.
Amen, not to mention he seems to have not read very far into the DMCA
The prohibition contained in subparagraph (A) shall not apply to persons who are users of a copyrighted work which is in a particular class of works, if such persons are, or are likely to be in the succeeding 3-year period, adversely affected by virtue of such prohibition in their ability to make noninfringing uses of that particular class of works under this title, as determined under subparagraph (C).
(I am not an attorney but I did stay at a holiday inn express last night)
From my understanding you can activate the game two times. If you uninstall correctly that will release the activation and then you could install it on any other machine.
Thieves stopped from playing the game by the protection scheme: ZERO (cracks already widely available, thieves were never going to buy the game anyways)
People who won’t buy the game, or will return it because of the copy protection scheme: From reading this forum and other high profile gaming sites, currently a lot more then zero.
2K increased revenue because of the copy protection
ZERO: customers + thieves
2K lost revenue because of copy protection:
A LOT: customers – (returns + lost sales due to ill will)
2K managed to find the perfect way to shoot themselves in both feet at once, and by their silence, is continuing to fire madly away. They’ll not see a dime in increased revenue, only losses. Tack on the undoubtedly large cost for licensing this silly scheme, as well as the enormous amount of ill will generated against the brand and the corporation, and the fallout for them only gets worse.
The real long term fallout of this particular piece of stupidity by the corporate cockroaches (stole that from someone else) isn't really going to be this game. The screw-up here already happened. The ill will, the returns, and the lost customers are events already in progress.
It'll be when the next developer considers what protection scheme to use in their software. I'm guessing that the fallout from this will take weeks to settle, and the ill will and bad publicity this issue generates will hopefully insure that this scheme will never see the light of day again.
Personally, I'm with Vostran here. I was a potential customer for this product who just signed up to say "No way Jose!".
To those who have already purchased the game and have no recourse for refund - my sympathies. Perhaps in the future, if 2k doesn’t change their stance, a class action could be pursued and you might see some pennies back on the dollar of your investment.
To 2k and all other developers and/or publishers reading these forums, here is my bottom line: I will never buy any game with such a draconian and ill thought out protection scheme.
PS: This thing has spread like wildfire to all the major gaming sites and blogs. Its reached the critical mass needed for traditional media to start picking up on the story. I give it another day or two at most before the big boys start reporting on this, especially if the scheme turns out to use a root kit to work.
PPS: If you’re a troll, don’t waste your breath. I never feed the trolls.
I made this Account only to post my Opinion to this situation...
My friend told me " BioShock has only 2 installations allowed "
HA HA wth are you talking about?
He sent me link to our Pre-Order Game provider and I read the comments... Seriously I was in Shock and I didnt take it seriously because that had to be Flame...
The longer I searched on the Web the more seriously this "Flame" smelled...
The best thing is that I needed to find all the info from 3RD sides... I wonder why the 2K Games has no info anywhere! It is F*CKING UNFAIR!
Yea I can get back my Installation count by unninstalling the game... For CHRISTS SAKE I formated my PC 6 times per a Half-Year without any chance to SAFE my DATA! ... that means I will call that CR*P SECUROM evry 2 months to give me back a few more Activations??? LOOL
OK so the CRACK users will play the BioShock with all the Comfort and the Paying Customers will be afraid of errors which would occur...?
OK sounds interesting but why you did that? There is already functional crack... Your ANTI-PIRATE prevention system sux IMO...
With my Friend I canceled the Pre-Order ( never did that in the past :q ) and we will wait to buy HALO 3 or COD4.
Saionara.l,
Yep
See here
http://forums.steampowered.com/forum...=589874&page=1
1. Anyone asserting legal conclusions that are not questionable, not in doubt, but just plain WRONG and yet stated as fact deserve to be ridiculed. You can choose whatever term you like--I'll call them idiots.
2. At no point did I ever question anyone's right to be angry. Hell, I'm angry. Enjoy your anger.
J. Gravitas
Yep, that's how we were told it would work. At the moment though, uninstalling does not release the activation. I'm assuming it is a bug in securoms software. However it is a completely inadequate method, as it does not account for hardware failures, and is against common behaviour when reformatting (do you think what software should I uninstall first when you go to reformat a machine?).
I've written a lot more on the subject on page 42 of this thread if you care to read.
There are reports that this "feature" of getting back installation points is broken atm.
Even if not, no windows will be bootable forever, and there is also always a possibility of hardware failure. Which means there is a fair chance that you maybe not able to play bioshock anymore.
Btw.: Could someone check if amazon is giving the -29% discount from today on, or was that before people get the truth about what they really bought?
I'm gonig to keep asking until I get a reply...
Dear Elizabeth 2K,
I think we are angry about this because you assume we are able to uninstall the game... what if we can't uninstall the game? (due to Virus/OS error/HDD failure/Overheating etc.)
This is a potential disaster as so much can happen to a computer rendering it unusable, requiring a re-install of Windows and therefore a re-install of Bioshock. I do not wish to call yourselves or secuROM everytime I want to play the game I paid for.
I have been polite each time I ask for a reply and I've been consitently ignored, is my point not valid?
Haha, I can't believe all you idiots complaining. Sure copyright protection sucks for the customer, but you all went out and instantly bought it (mostly) without even checking.
360 version is better anyway, so I'm just kind of laughing at all of you.
from a nother thread. SO lets put the pitchforks down for a sec.Originally Posted by irrationallevine View Post
I've followed up on the circular email with securom and we are working on this issue. I agree, it sucks, and we need to get that sorted.
I've been told by 2k that we will.
-Ken
you dont seem to get the argument do you ? the point is there was nothing to check nothing to read and nothing to be told about said copy protection it was undocumented. Iv never in my 20+ years of gameing had a problem with copy protection till this week starforce or any other securom protected game so i think there a problem and guess what alot of other do too.
did the farmers out there pitch forks down when the monster turn around no they did when it was dead. not before so untill its actually fixed dont think thats gunna happen.
Waited about 12 hours and you would have seen all this stuff on most gaming news websites and stuff.
There's no reason to buy a game with Starforce or SecuROM or any other rootkit, and no it's normally not announced that the game will ship with it, and ☺☺☺☺ like this happens and everyone cries.
You need to wait a day or two before getting a PC game after it releases if you want to avoid this stuff.
You can't uninstall the game if your windows install just got corrupted.
Furthermore, you must remember to uninstall the game prior to reinstalling windows, so if you buy a new piece of hardware requiring an OS reinstall (for example mother board) and forget to uninstall Bioshock, you are hosed.
☺☺☺, I have almost never uninstalled a game, but I have had to REinstall over games numerous times to restore their registry entries after new hardware installs or OS corruptions. So it takes just once of me forgetting to uninstall before I am hosed. How did no one report on this prerelease?
No way I am buying this until this is fixed.
1201(b), which you accurately quote, can excuse the usage of such circumvention (i.e., cracks) by those who otherwise legitimately own the game (since they are not gaining unauthorized access to such works). It does nothing to excuse the creator of the crack, nor to change the fact that the creation, distribution or sale of such circumvention measures are all illegal acts.
In short, if you bought the game, you can arguably use a crack for it. (I say arguably, since if you've exceeded the idiotic two-install limit imposed by 2k in the case of Bioshock, you ARE then gaining unauthorized access to the game.) But the guy who programmed that crack is still up for fines, civil liability, and jailtime.
And yes, I think it's a stupid system too.
J. Gravitas
Well, no offense, but you are one of the reasons why the security measures are in place. Sharing a copy between friends is not legal. I know your arguments so no need to tell me, but it's still illegal. I have a strong suspicion that is why so many people are up in arms about number of installs (Aside from those having legitimate issues activating the game). How many PCs do you really need to install the game on for your own use? I can see a desktop and a laptop. Any more than that and it starts looking suspicious.I made this Account only to post my Opinion to this situation...
My friend told me " BioShock has only 2 installations allowed "
HA HA wth are you talking about?
He sent me link to our Pre-Order Game provider and I read the comments... Seriously I was in Shock and I didnt take it seriously because that had to be Flame...
The longer I searched on the Web the more seriously this "Flame" smelled...
The best thing is that I needed to find all the info from 3RD sides... I wonder why the 2K Games has no info anywhere! It is F*CKING UNFAIR!
Yea I can get back my Installation count by unninstalling the game... For CHRISTS SAKE I formated my PC 6 times per a Half-Year without any chance to SAFE my DATA! ... that means I will call that CR*P SECUROM evry 2 months to give me back a few more Activations??? LOOL
OK so the CRACK users will play the BioShock with all the Comfort and the Paying Customers will be afraid of errors which would occur...?
OK sounds interesting but why you did that? There is already functional crack... Your ANTI-PIRATE prevention system sux IMO...
With my Friend I canceled the Pre-Order ( never did that in the past :q ) and we will wait to buy HALO 3 or COD4.
Saionara
NO they need to inform there customers about it. The attitude you have is a defeatist one why are you so willing to let the company screw you over in the future why not get behind the paying customer and get a decent product for there money?
I wrote "with friend I canceled the Pre-Order" ... that means WE both had Pre-Ordered this game :F
Yea I just need to install it on one PC... But what happens when I will need to format my PC without possibility of Unninstaling BioShock? Simply I loose my 1 installation count...
you won't see any pirates in here ☺☺☺☺☺ing about this, just paying customers and spoiler monkeys apparently.. the pyrates are busy working on the fix.
dump securom completely so I can play this game 10 years from now if I want to. phone home software sucks and must be exterminated.
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